Apple To Palm: It's On. The Pre Is Locked Out Of iTunes

Can you imagine the uproar if Microsoft did this? Apple not only controls their markets, they own them.

FTC - are you listening? Unless you have an iPod or an iPhone, probably not.

Like Google using a “free” OS to in an anti-competitive move to generate ad revenue, Apple uses iTunes to dominate the phone and mp3 markets. Can you imagine the uproar if Microsoft did this?

Apple not only controls their markets, they own them.

FTC - are you listening? Unless you have an iPod or an iPhone, guess not.

screw itunes. there's lots of WAY better methods to obtain, sort and tag music. palm shouldn't give a rats a$$.

Somebody breaks into your house and steals your belongings. Then you buy a good lock for your door to protect your family, and YOU'RE the bad guy??? I think the management of Palm are criminals and should do jail time for reverse engineering the iPhone in the first place.

One of the reasons the iPod and iPhone has been so successful compared to other MP3 players is because of iTunes. The iPod isn't the best music player and iTunes isn't the best jukebox software, but they work so well together. That's why I fell in love with my first iPod and now own my 2nd iPhone. After several MP3 players and smartphones, iTunes makes the easiest sync. Palm should develop their own software to host the Pre, not hack into Apple's software.

Carl, you are a troll. Didn't you read the entry? It says Palm would be wise not to fight this in public. Also, make sure the outrage doesn't backfire.

What's the installed base for iPhone vs. Palm Pre? Most AAPL users won't give a rip. Most people using other devices won't care, either. So only "some" of the Pre users will be inconvenienced by this move, and an even smaller percentage will be moved to voice their opinion.

Deal with it.

AAPL created iTunes on its own. It developed the iPhone when every mobile mfr. said their efforts would be futile (at best) and possibly misguided. Now AAPL has shown the iPhone is a hit and iTunes is a central part of its appeal.

What's next? Should GS disclose its trading algorithm? Should MSFT be required to allow XBox software to run on a Wii? Maybe Ford should provide warranty service for Nissans?

It's called competitive advantage. We used to reward innovation in this country, not water it down.

Carl, you are a troll. Didn't you read the entry? It says Palm would be wise not to fight this in public. Also, make sure the outrage doesn't backfire.

What's the installed base for iPhone vs. Palm Pre? Most AAPL users won't give a rip. Most people using other devices won't care, either. So only "some" of the Pre users will be inconvenienced by this move, and an even smaller percentage will be moved to voice their opinion.

Deal with it.

AAPL created iTunes on its own. It developed the iPhone when every mobile mfr. said their efforts would be futile (at best) and possibly misguided. Now AAPL has shown the iPhone is a hit and iTunes is a central part of its appeal.

What's next? Should GS disclose its trading algorithm? Should MSFT be required to allow XBox software to run on a Wii? Maybe Ford should provide warranty service for Nissans?

It's called competitive advantage. We used to reward innovation in this country, not water it down.

If you use booth camp from a Mac computer will it work? - how not so or how so?

How is it stealing if I legally buy my songs from itunes and am able to easily download it to my pre, seems like that would be good customer service. As it stands I feel like as a loyal customer of Itunes I am being shafted. (By the way I also own an Ipod).

Apple spent hundreds of millions of $ building iTunes and runs it basically at break even so that they can support sales of Apple devices, yet people expect Apple to let other manufacturers piggyback on Apple's investment.

Apple is NOT like Microsoft. If Microsoft was running iTunes, you would be tied to a device with a bad user experience, and you would have to re-buy your music every year or it stops working. Oops, MS already did that with the MS music store and their "subscription" model.

mike.t

Did Apple every promise that yourr songs would work on a pre?

I think the issue is that the Pre 'pretends to be an iPod' when is syncs.

re: "Apple spokeswoman Natalie Kerris. “It also disables devices falsely pretending to be iPods,"

If Palm does screwy things and there are problems with syncing with iTunes as an iPod, I bet you 50% of Pre owners will blame Apple.

Palm should let it's users access iTunes like every third party music player and not "pretend to be an iPod".

Also Palm is getting free advertising now claiming the Pre is as good as an iPod or iPhone as it syncs to iTunes like an iPod while paying no development fees to Apple for iTunes R&D. Palm should use iTunes like every other third party music player.

As others on different threads have pointed out, iTunes makes it very easy for another app to manage the transfer (non-DRM'd) files to other devices.

iTunes includes an unencrypted XML file listing the tracks in iTunes. The music files no longer have DRM (new music, or upgraded past songs, or ripped songs). Any desktop application has full access to that XML file, the file system, and the USB bus. [credit: sdfisher on AppleInsider]

Palm or other 3rd party can create an application to gain access to all non-DRM music in the iTunes collection. Apple is *not* locking non-DRM music into only being managed by iTunes. Palm is just being lazy, and trying to free ride the popularity of iTunes, rather than develop their own app.

Just use doubleTwist (http://doubletwist.com/). It gets your iTunes on to your Pre nicely.

all the people who support apple are just insanely brainwashed. When are they going to realize that apple is the microsoft of digital music. I don't think the 2 billion people in China and India will give a rat's ass about the ipod in 5 years as they will be using some other cheaper linux device playing their music. Long live cheap and free.

"AAPL created iTunes on its own"

Not entirely on its own. Apple also bought outside code and programmers. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SoundJam_MP

Seems to me that Apple is concerned about Palm using iTunes as sync software for their devices, not trying to block loading media you own from being loaded onto the Pre.

There is a big difference between the two. Palm should write, pay for and distribute their own sync solution - it could easily access media in an iTunes library, and should provide for contact/calendar/note sync for OS X and Windows as well.

Since Palm doesn't have a music store and seems to want to promote iTunes, no Pre user would have to worry about buying music on the Pre and being unable it to iTunes anyway.

jeez. iTunes doesn't have a lock on your music. it just manages it all for you.

the files are sitting on your hard drive. drag and drop to your pre, or use some other software to provide the sync for you. many different apps can read the actual iTunes DB, since it's just an XML file.

you just can't use iTunes to sync to non-apple devices. that sounds perfectly fair to me. palm can step up and create their own software if they want to play the real game.

The problem are the Pre owners who purchase something expecting its hack to be continually supported. Even the guys in Palm have called it a hack. C'mon, this is just stupid. If it stops working, the consumer has no one to blame but themselves trying to be tricky little bastards trying to circumvent something to their own advantage. And stop with the "monopoly" bullshit. There is Napster, Rhapsody, Amazon, hell even Wal-Mart has gotten into this. Oh, and here is another one...CDs!! MP3s!!! OMG We're all locked into this iTunes juggernaught!
iTunes came about from the code of SoundJam which was then painstakenly changed into iTunes. Apple even hired the SoundJam guys and gave them positions at Apple. Everyone told Apple they were "stupid" and how dare they compete with MS and Creative, etc.. Same some with the iPod and also with the iPhone. In EVERY case Apple was supposed to be the "stupid" underdog about to be "smashed", or "eaten alive" by the big dogs of the industries.
They made some good shit. Buy it if you like it, don't buy it if you don't, but don't whine when your shitty hack stops working.

Apple provide a documented and supported method for third party applications to access the iTunes meta data via an XML file. The media files themselves are simply files in the file system and so are freely accessible in any case. Apple don't have to provide this. Plenty of third party software use this published method; Missing Sync for Pre being a pertinent example.
Syncing directly from within iTunes is clearly limited to Apple hardware. This is a competitive differentiator that Apple are entirely in their rights to do as they do not have a monopoly position.
There is absolutely nothing stopping Palm from writing their own syncing software rather than trying to piggy back on iTunes syncing.

Palm are not some little startup company with no resources to write syncronisation software. In fact Palm clearly have many, many years experience writing software to synchronize files from computers to their USB (even RS232) connected handheld devices. The only extra thing they have to do is parse the iTunes XML Library file. This is trivial for any half decent developer.

But for some reason, Palm do not want to do this. Maybe they are obsessed that their device appears to be an iPod and so is shown in the iTunes UI? Maybe they don't want their users to have to install software on their computer as syncing happens "in the cloud", and so doesn't need extra software, right? It is very strange that Palm attempted to go down the iPod impersonation route rather than provide their own simple iTunes syncronisation solution.

People can't growl at Apple over this - it's their darn software, and kudos for making it so darn compelling.

I'm on my 4th iPod (no one forced me to do this), but I purchased a BlackBerry Tour.

Which, incidentally, works with iTunes, since it does it the *legal* way.

And to ajolie - China will rot in a sea of spam and human viruses. Free software and hardware aside, the terrorist nation of China is in deep poop. Long live H1N1.

@ Leo
"If you use booth camp from a Mac computer will it work? - how not so or how so?"

First of all, it's BOOT Camp.

And NO, it will not work. All Boot Camp allows you to do is boot Windows. Mac or Windows, the updated iTunes app will no longer work with a Pre.

Good lord, are we going to start up with the "loyal customer" nonsense?

I bought all these Xbox games, now I have a Wii and I want to be able to play them! As a loyal Xbox customer, I feel I am being shafted!

Using a manufacturer's product doesn't give you some kind of privileged status to demand whatever you want. Adults understand this. Sadly, there seem to be fewer and fewer of them.

To Josh - are you at all literate or just a complete troll? We here in the U.S. have by far the most cases and fatalities from H1N1 swine flu, you moron. Way to insult our own citizens, Josh-the-dipwad.

To Josh - are you at all literate or just a complete troll? We here in the U.S. have by far the most cases and fatalities from H1N1 swine flu, you moron. Way to insult our own citizens, Josh-the-dipwad.

It's called intellectual property. Apple developed the iPod and iTunes as a bundle. If you do not want to buy from iTunes, you can buy from one of the other competitive music download sites. If you do not want to use an iPod, buy a Zune or any other MP3 Player. Apple is nothing like Microsoft. Microsoft offers inferior products that crash and breakdown all the time - and they will squeeze every dime they can from individuals and companies, while trying to shut out any competition. They are basically gangsters. Apple on the other hand sells a superior product, which is high quality, proprietary and charges you once a fair price for years of happiness. More importantly, they are not afraid of competing with others - just don't infringe their patents and proprietary technology without paying royalties. That's sounds like a pretty reasonable premise on their part.

It's called intellectual property. Apple developed the iPod and iTunes as a bundle. If you do not want to buy from iTunes, you can buy from one of the other competitive music download sites. If you do not want to use an iPod, buy a Zune or any other MP3 Player. Apple is nothing like Microsoft. Microsoft offers inferior products that crash and breakdown all the time - and they will squeeze every dime they can from individuals and companies, while trying to shut out any competition. They are basically gangsters. Apple on the other hand sells a superior product, which is high quality, proprietary and charges you once a fair price for years of happiness. More importantly, they are not afraid of competing with others - just don't infringe their patents and proprietary technology without paying royalties. That's sounds like a pretty reasonable premise on their part.

It's called intellectual property. Apple developed the iPod and iTunes as a bundle. If you do not want to buy from iTunes, you can buy from one of the other competitive music download sites. If you do not want to use an iPod, buy a Zune or any other MP3 Player. Apple is nothing like Microsoft. Microsoft offers inferior products that crash and breakdown all the time - and they will squeeze every dime they can from individuals and companies, while trying to shut out any competition. They are basically gangsters. Apple on the other hand sells a superior product, which is high quality, proprietary and charges you once a fair price for years of happiness. More importantly, they are not afraid of competing with others - just don't infringe their patents and proprietary technology without paying royalties. That's sounds like a pretty reasonable premise on their part.

Of course people can growl at Apple. Apple took an action they did not have to take. There is nothing illegal about what Pre did. And there is no benefit to customers provided by Apple's action. Whether Apple's business qualifies as a monopoly is a legitimate discussion, but regardless of that conclusion Apple did something that made life more difficult for consumers. People not only have a right to not like that action. They have a right to express it. And people who say they don't have that right, or that Apple was somehow compelled to do this are being dishonest. Apple could have let this go and the world would have been a slightly better place for some people. I don't use iTunes so I don't care, but I'm used to seeing this kind of behavior from Microsoft. Similar behavior killed DR DOS, WordPerfect, Netscape, and who what else. Ultimately, if a company is determined to have a monopoly than such anticompetitive behavior is determined even in retrospect to be illegal. But again, illegal or not, Apple took an action it did not have to take. That's a fact.

Of course people can growl at Apple. Apple took an action they did not have to take. There is nothing illegal about what Pre did. And there is no benefit to customers provided by Apple's action. Whether Apple's business qualifies as a monopoly is a legitimate discussion, but regardless of that conclusion Apple did something that made life more difficult for consumers. People not only have a right to not like that action. They have a right to express it. And people who say they don't have that right, or that Apple was somehow compelled to do this are being dishonest. Apple could have let this go and the world would have been a slightly better place for some people. I don't use iTunes so I don't care, but I'm used to seeing this kind of behavior from Microsoft. Similar behavior killed DR DOS, WordPerfect, Netscape, and who what else. Ultimately, if a company is determined to have a monopoly than such anticompetitive behavior is determined even in retrospect to be illegal. But again, illegal or not, Apple took an action it did not have to take. That's a fact.

Of course people can growl at Apple. Apple took an action they did not have to take. There is nothing illegal about what Pre did. And there is no benefit to customers provided by Apple's action. Whether Apple's business qualifies as a monopoly is a legitimate discussion, but regardless of that conclusion Apple did something that made life more difficult for consumers. People not only have a right to not like that action. They have a right to express it. And people who say they don't have that right, or that Apple was somehow compelled to do this are being dishonest. Apple could have let this go and the world would have been a slightly better place for some people. I don't use iTunes so I don't care, but I'm used to seeing this kind of behavior from Microsoft. Similar behavior killed DR DOS, WordPerfect, Netscape, and who what else. Ultimately, if a company is determined to have a monopoly than such anticompetitive behavior is determined even in retrospect to be illegal. But again, illegal or not, Apple took an action it did not have to take. That's a fact.

Who wants to have to learn and install 3 music sync tools? Who doesn't already own an IPod? If you raised your hand to both of those you, like me, are in the minority who don't care about this. For everyone else, it constitutes yet another barrier to entry for others in the marketplace.

"Carl In Silicon Valley
July 15, 2009 03:51 PM

"FTC - are you listening? Unless you have an iPod or an iPhone, probably not."

More government control will not fix this, I suppose you voted for Obama too. Get some education please!!!

iTunes is a management software provided for FREE by Apple to help manage the music onto their hardware. They are under *no* obligation to offer this free software be compatible with other hardware, and it's rediculous to suggest that they should.

The music is all stored locally on your hard drive in easily discovered directories and folders with a xml file that is trivial to parse for 3rd parties that want to load the same music onto their device outside of iTunes. Many other phone manufacturers already do this. Palm wanted to short cut the process and piggy back on Apple's software without bothering to write their own software.

Clearly the people who are bellyaching at Apple about this have zero respect for intellectual property, hard work, innovation, or fairness. Sadly this is typical of the internet.

iTunes is a management software provided for FREE by Apple to help manage the music onto their hardware. They are under *no* obligation to offer this free software be compatible with other hardware, and it's ridiculous to suggest that they should.

The music is all stored locally on your hard drive in easily discovered directories and folders with a xml file that is trivial to parse for 3rd parties that want to load the same music onto their device outside of iTunes. Many other phone manufacturers already do this. Palm wanted to short cut the process and piggy back on Apple's software without bothering to write their own software.

Clearly the people who are bellyaching at Apple about this have zero respect for intellectual property, hard work, innovation, or fairness. Sadly this is typical of the internet.

@Scott...You're a blathering fool! Shut up or at least think before you open your pie hole. Better yet, I want your Pre, it will make me feel better, give it to me, after all I have the RIGHT to feel good & have things that I want, right? What's wrong with you people? Didn't your mommas teach you any morals? Or do you truly believe that anyone has a right to whatever they want, simply because they want it. God, Save this world from people like these idiots.

Well, considering there is no way to edit posts, and your post does not even appear right away after you submit it. And given that a whole ton of people double posted before I did, I guess I don't have to feel too bad about my double post.

I am a happy iPod owner, iTunes user and Palm Pre owner. I was very happy when this interaction worked. I knew that Apple might go this route and I would have to spend time setting up alternatives. iTunes is more than just management software it is a multiple billion dollar a year business which by most estimates is very profitable. It is not an excuse to buy an iPod but an independent profit center. Apple certainly could have allowed this solution to continue to exist without affecting their bottom line and even if Palm Pre users were disgruntled enough to switch away from iPods and iTunes I doubt it would make enough of a blip on the radar to slow down that juggernaut. While they do not prevent people from accessing their music I would guess that the majority of users would consider this a problem that they would not tackle due to the lack of computer savvy in the world at large. I hope Palm updates and continues to provide a solution for my Pre, but if they don't I guess I am on the way to adding another convoluted step to my process.

Nobody probably cares anyway but here are some of my thoughts:

1) you don't HAVE to use iTunes to sync to anything (not even your iPod) but it sure is easy
2) your non-DRM songs are just there on your hard drive, it's not like itunes encrypts them or anything
3) it would be perfectly possible for Palm to write an iTunes plugin that does the syncing. the one difference would probably be that you'd have to push a button to sync a playlist.
4) I think Apple couldn't care less who uses iTunes to sync with non-apple devices, it's the fact that Palm promotes its Pre with this argument that made Apple block it.

Switch to Rhapsody. Unlimited music for $10 a month.

Stephen said:
Tunes is a management software provided for FREE by Apple to help manage the music onto their hardware. They are under *no* obligation to offer this free software be compatible with other hardware, and it's ridiculous to suggest that they should.
--
Apple should tread carefully here. While there are other music solutions out there, Apple is very close to the legal definition of a monopoly and should be very careful how it proceedes for this and future similar scenarios. In this case, Apple appears to have delibrately made their software incompatible with a competitor's hardware; software which, as a whole, is considered to be the dominant menthod of distribution of digital music.
It's almost as if Microsoft deliberately made Google not work on windows, and then boasted about it.. (Conspiracy theorists aside, that is not the case--they are far too scrutinized)

Let's all watch this one-- I doubt it's over

honestly my first thought when seeing this last night was "feels like a move that microsoft would have made years ago"

I feel this is a bad move by Apple. It goes against the image of friendliness they have worked hard to achieve in their marketing. In spite of their user friendly marketing and rabid fan base for hardware (me included) I think it is time the consumer opened their eyes and see Apple for what it actually is.

Closed systems are so 2002. come on now.

1. Apple would still be selling DRM protected music if it weren't for competition from other mp3 download services. That's the free market working, and Apple heard it loud and clear. Thanks to all who DID NOT FOLLOW LIKE LEMMINGS to the iPod and supported other devices and music download services!
2. Apple is unlawfully tying the iPod and the iTunes service. The FTC or US Attorney should investigate this.

I think it's brilliant what Apple did. Why in hell would you let a company copy your product (the iphone) and then let it use your software platform (itunes)

I think it's brilliant what Apple did. Why in hell would you let a company copy your product (the iphone) and then let it use your software platform (itunes)

I'd like to applaud Palm for a second.
Yes I have a Pre, but I'm not mad at Apple, they have every right to do what they did, more power to them.
My focus is on the brilliant strategy of Palm. If anyone was dumb enough to think Palm didn't know this would happen or plan for this then you shouldn't be expressing your naive opinion.
Like Miles has pointed out, Apple's image has been to differentiate itself from "big bad" Microsoft. This move brings them closer in many eyes. It also inspires all the idiots screaming that Apple is a monopoly.
Palm has pulled a cunning move to put Apple in a bad light, I applaud their effort.

Clearly double standards abound, I see. I cannot support Apple on this move simply because Microsoft is held to a different standard.

If Microsoft tried to do what Apple is doing, the European Union and US would have their heads, yet it's okay for Apple??? Apple developed iTunes and Microsoft developed Windows, IE and Media Player.

Further, to the commenter that suggested that Palm was stealing: Music I purchased thru iTunes belongs to me and I should be able to add it to whatever freaking device I choose. For Apple to block this access is unforgivable.

Guys, it's just syncing songs. Not stealing technologies.

This is exactly why Apple is more evil than Microsoft. If Apple had their way, you could only use Apple hardware running Apple software, with Apple accessories, bought at an Apple store, and financed through Apple....assuming you had signed a contract promising to not disclose any negative opinions about Apple or its products.

Think about it. If Apple made cars, what brand of tires do you think you would have to buy? Could you buy a standard aftermarket stereo? Standard battery and motor oil? I don't think so.

I'll stick with my Android phone. The freedom to connect its USB to any computer, to a PS3, or to my car far outweighs the Apple lock in.

That statement from Palm about how Apple was cutting off iTunes users, is diversion away from the ridiculousness of Palm's tactics. They are trying to ride the coattails of Apple's success with the iPod/iPhone/iTunes store. Did Palm miss the lawsuit against Psystar, who is trying to ride Apple's coattails on the Apple OS/Mac platform?

I mean really, did Palm think Apple would simply roll over? Tres folle!

The sad thing is that no one is thinking about their customers. They are the ones getting whiplashed by the big corporate egos.

When you reach a point of market dominance, like it or not the anti-trust authorities will get involved. Microsoft Windows is the case in point. As it stands now, Microsoft can't write their software the way they want. Remember Apple got in trouble in Europe over iTunes a few years ago, so it's not without precedent.

I wish Palm success in their efforts - it will break the virtuous cycle of iTune and iPod/iPhone. It's called competition.

People are totally missing the point. You have purchased your music and you have a right to synch it to whatever device you so choose. Apple accepts this by having non-DRM and having it in XML format, plus publishing specs for other companies to develop their own apps.

iTunes is a break even app that Apple sells for free to stimulate ipod and iphone sales.

Palm is free to develop their own synching software. If not, use some of the free stuff on the web.

@MD Check your facts first

"Apple would still be selling DRM protected music if it weren't for competition from other mp3 download services"

Incorrect. Almost 2.5 years ago, Steve Jobs posted an open letter explaining why Apple had to use DRM and that they would embrace DRM-free music "in a heartbeat" if the record labels allowed it. Read the full press release here:

http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughtsonmusic/

=====

"Apple is unlawfully tying the iPod and the iTunes service. The FTC or US Attorney should investigate this."

Incorrect again. iTunes is an application that allows one to easily sync musing to one's iPod. You do not need to use it

In anycase, you have missed the entire premise of the article.

Amarok developers have stated that implementing Palm Pre synchronizing support is very easy with the existing API.

If someone implements syncing support for the Pre, Amarok will be a superior substitute for iTunes
http://amarok.kde.org/

You should all learn about Game Theory.

In the end open source solutions that allow people to use whatever software with ANY device will prevail. The I-Phone is going to be up against some serious device and OS competition in the future from Linux.(Pre, Android, Chrome, Moblin, Limo). Companies like Google and Intel are heavily involved in case you haven't heard.

@Carl In Silicon Valley
MS does stuff like this ALL the time. Remember Office 2007 and the new formats? How about the changes in Exchange Server 2007? A company developing a piece of software can change anything it wants. And since you live in a free market you can voice your opinion by not buying the product.

Apple is not stopping you from syncing data with your Pre. They only don't want you to use their software to do it and guess what ... it's totally legal ethical, etc.

When Apple chose to shut the door, it actually opens another door for Pre. If Pre is smart enough, they should use this oppotunity to develope their own software which has less barriers than Itunes, or maybe no barrier at all. And that will become an big advantage of their own software, and they too become the loved and supported "under dog". It's also a good time to do that, becoz Apple is far from being in a monopoly position like Mircosoft's in the Music Industry.

About Itunes' future in China, it's quite unclear in a forseeable future. Free is the only way out here until now, nobody will spend 1 dollor (or 6 to 7 RMB) to buy a single song here, it's just too expensive. And affordable price will be 0.1 RMB, or 2 cents here. Crazy? Maybe. But it's ture. A good example is www.qidian.com, a website which sells copyright novel, the price an article of 1000 Chinese charater is just 0.02 RMB, or 1 seventh cent. This website has been growing like crazy for the last several years. The point is, a price accepted by end user is the only way to win the Intellectual Property battle, in China.
PS, I am not talking about market of coporate user.

When Apple chose to shut the door, it actually opens another door for Pre. If Pre is smart enough, they should use this oppotunity to develope their own software which has less barriers than Itunes, or maybe no barrier at all. And that will become an big advantage of their own software, and they too become the loved and supported "under dog". It's also a good time to do that, becoz Apple is far from being in a monopoly position like Mircosoft's in the Music Industry.

About Itunes' future in China, it's quite unclear in a forseeable future. Free is the only way out here until now, nobody will spend 1 dollor (or 6 to 7 RMB) to buy a single song here, it's just too expensive. And affordable price will be 0.1 RMB, or 2 cents here. Crazy? Maybe. But it's ture. A good example is www.qidian.com, a website which sells copyright novel, the price an article of 1000 Chinese charater is just 0.02 RMB, or 1 seventh cent. This website has been growing like crazy for the last several years. The point is, a price accepted by end user is the only way to win the Intellectual Property battle, in China.
PS, I am not talking about market of coporate user.

When Apple chose to shut the door, it actually opens another door for Pre. If Pre is smart enough, they should use this oppotunity to develope their own software which has less barriers than Itunes, or maybe no barrier at all. And that will become an big advantage of their own software, and they too become the loved and supported "under dog". It's also a good time to do that, becoz Apple is far from being in a monopoly position like Mircosoft's in the Music Industry.

About Itunes' future in China, it's quite unclear in a forseeable future. Free is the only way out here until now, nobody will spend 1 dollor (or 6 to 7 RMB) to buy a single song here, it's just too expensive. And affordable price will be 0.1 RMB, or 2 cents here. Crazy? Maybe. But it's ture. A good example is www.qidian.com, a website which sells copyright novel, the price an article of 1000 Chinese charater is just 0.02 RMB, or 1 seventh cent. This website has been growing like crazy for the last several years. The point is, a price accepted by end user is the only way to win the Intellectual Property battle, in China.
PS, I am not talking about market of coporate user.

What's the point of all the people here pointing at Palm and saying "But the Pre is pretending to be an iPod". I have an iMac and it's pretending it is a Windows Computer to my Dell business notebook all the time. I'm sure Microsoft invested a lot of money to create their file sharing protocol and implementation and the samba developers reverse engineered it.

So what is the difference? That you like Apple and you don't like MS? What would you say if Windows 7 would block Samba?

@Tom L

Well said sir.
That's more or less what occurred to me when reading all the BS about the millions spent on iTunes R&D.

This is just another case where consumers get shafted, not a holy war where Apple is protecting it's IP.
Vendor lock-in is bad for you(the consumer) whether it's MSFT or AAPL doing it.

My take on this is to avoid Apple products in the future. Stick to open standards and open source.

Just my 0.02$ worth.

Lolz funny old fight on here.

Two facts are plain - iTunes is over rated and very nasty software that just ties you into Apple's way of doing things, doesn't really give you what you pay for, and should be avoided at all costs. I used it for two years, it's the main cause of Blue screens in Vista, and bullies you into accepting all kinds of crap. Use Banshee or Amarok, they're way better, work better, and don't push you or nag you in any way.

The iPhone 3GS is basically available for about $1150 - if you agree to sign up for a rather expensive 2 year contract then they know they'll screw you for more than $2000 - so they could give it away, but they make it very cheap at $199 - oldest story in the book. I remember ten years ago when Orange came out with a 'one penny per minute' plan, and kept quiet that if you call Vodafone you paid 50p a minute, and you're tucked away into the contract.

People should wake up. Say NO to contracts - they only ever look cheaper than pay-as-you-go but they never really are. Maybe you use your phone a lot right now.

We got wise to it in England about ten years ago, and around the world it seems that nobody else would fall for this crap.

You Americans love your crazy marketing schemes don't you? Love to get screwed over good and proper!

Lolz funny old fight on here.

Two facts are plain - iTunes is over rated and very nasty software that just ties you into Apple's way of doing things, doesn't really give you what you pay for, and should be avoided at all costs. I used it for two years, it's the main cause of Blue screens in Vista, and bullies you into accepting all kinds of crap. Use Banshee or Amarok, they're way better, work better, and don't push you or nag you in any way.

The iPhone 3GS is basically available for about $1150 - if you agree to sign up for a rather expensive 2 year contract then they know they'll screw you for more than $2000 - so they could give it away, but they make it very cheap at $199 - oldest story in the book. I remember ten years ago when Orange came out with a 'one penny per minute' plan, and kept quiet that if you call Vodafone you paid 50p a minute, and you're tucked away into the contract.

People should wake up. Say NO to contracts - they only ever look cheaper than pay-as-you-go but they never really are. Maybe you use your phone a lot right now.

We got wise to it in England about ten years ago, and around the world it seems that nobody else would fall for this crap.

You Americans love your crazy marketing schemes don't you? Love to get screwed over good and proper!

ITunes is overrated. I do not use nor do I have any desire to do when there are many other ways to purchase your music and get it on to your computer. The same goes for videos or movies.

ITunes is very user friendly which is why it has its success. But with a little research one can get their music and even full length movies from videos without much hassle.

With the way people google, moodle, text message, myspace, facebook and youtube, if they would just invest in more research they could discover ways of doing more with their phones without having to get an iphone or an ipod or an itune for that matter.

Nuff.

ITunes is overrated. I do not use nor do I have any desire to do when there are many other ways to purchase your music and get it on to your computer. The same goes for videos or movies.

ITunes is very user friendly which is why it has its success. But with a little research one can get their music and even full length movies from videos without much hassle.

With the way people google, moodle, text message, myspace, facebook and youtube, if they would just invest in more research they could discover ways of doing more with their phones without having to get an iphone or an ipod or an itune for that matter.

Nuff.

ITunes is overrated. I do not use nor do I have any desire to do when there are many other ways to purchase your music and get it on to your computer. The same goes for videos or movies.

ITunes is very user friendly which is why it has its success. But with a little research one can get their music and even full length movies from videos without much hassle.

With the way people google, moodle, text message, myspace, facebook and youtube, if they would just invest in more research they could discover ways of doing more with their phones without having to get an iphone or an ipod or an itune for that matter.

Nuff.

ITunes is overrated. I do not use nor do I have any desire to do when there are many other ways to purchase your music and get it on to your computer. The same goes for videos or movies.

ITunes is very user friendly which is why it has its success. But with a little research one can get their music and even full length movies from videos without much hassle.

With the way people google, moodle, text message, myspace, facebook and youtube, if they would just invest in more research they could discover ways of doing more with their phones without having to get an iphone or an ipod or an itune for that matter.

Nuff.