Visa Abuse: Help From India?

Fox guarding the henhouse. Give me money & power, and I will
help you in your charity work and maybe feed you, after counting my money.

Instead of blaming American education for not preparing students properly, and for not encouraging minorities and women to enter the engineering field, why not look at the real reason students no longer want to enter this field—no job prospects. With American engineers and computer programmers no longer able to compete against a huge influx of cheaper imported labor via H-1B and L-1 work visas, and with many more high-tech jobs going "offshore," it's simple economics. Students do not want to invest many thousands of dollars studying in a field for which there are no job prospects.

Me and my IT colleagues lost our programming jobs when our company imported programmers and made the Americans train them in order to receive severance. The company posted LCA sheets as required by law, and thus, we learned that the visiting programmers are earning about half of their American counterparts. Whenever I contact my elected representatives, the Dept. of Labor and the Dept. of Commerce about this, their shoddy excuse is that Americans aren't educated enough or prepared enough or smart enough to do high tech. But I'm not surprised. That's what the corporations and the media tell them.

Myths:
1) These are Temporary (Guest) Worker Visas and NOT IMMIGRANT VISAS
2) They are paid the same wage as Americans, they are paid about 12,000 or more less
than their American counterparts
3) They are just average programmers and in fact some of them are incompetent
4) There is no labor shortage with millions of highly skilled Americans and Permanent Residents unemployed.
Hire local it's the American thing to do.

Greedy Companies use them to replace Americans with:

1) Cheap Foreign workers - These companies don't want to pay the prevailing wage.
2) Younger Foreign Workers - Those over 35 are discriminated because of their age.

Hire Americans and Permanent Residents. Help America.
Yet another sellout of the American worker, just so a few executives can make a few more million.

Hiring or continuing to employ an H1B worker (or any other VISA) in the US in our current time of crisis is un-American.

Why have a comment, when you don't allow posting that are anti-h1b? Steve Hamm you should go back to India you paid propagandists of India. Americans will win on this one because we are tired of getting replace by cheap foreign labor sponsored by India Inc.

Americans are whiners who can't compete with my Indian brothers and sisters. We worked our ass to get to the top.

Steve, Once again and yet again the publicity flacks at Nasscom have hijacked the debate. Protectionism, baloney. Nasscom is a just a cheerleader for the India Tech. How about US defense contractors that have to offset 30-50% of the sales price to services by Indian Vendors and then have to transfer the technology and then manufacture 50% in India. "Oh no" says India "that is not protectionist."

This type of continued arrogance by Nasscom and Genpath will come back to haunt them. The Philippines, China and Eastern Europe are gaining fast.

How many visa does Genpath use and how many Americans work for Genpath in India?

Steve, thanks for shedding light, however biased, on the hi-tech slave trade. But Nasscom cries crocodile tears. As soon as the smoke clears, they will begin their back-room dealings with U.S. politicians to ship in a few million more indentured servants. But they have one thing wrong -- American techies are angrier than is believed. In fact, we have already started to retaliate against the Anti-American discrimination that has been promoted by the likes of writers like you, Vivek, and powerful lobbyists like NASSCOM and USINPAC. Everyday, the Office of Special Counsel at the Justice Department gets more Charge Forms, and are forced to investigate cases where Americans have had to train their Indian replacements, or have been eliminated to make room for H-1Bs and L-1s.

At times like these it certainly helps to take an unbiased, objective look at the situation. I am a manager at a large US consulting firm that has a huge presence in India. Over the last few years, reacting to customer pressure on costs (and the unsaid drive for profit from upper management), our firm has setup large offshore centers for client support - I personally setup a few teams. This directly lead to over capacity in the US workforce of our firm and I had the displeasure of laying off several very talented native born Americans (including an ABD). The personal situations of some these people we had to let go is gut wrenching - a guy with 3 very young children and a stay-at-home (home-maker) wife; a very talented guy from a good (popular) tech school who recently bought a house, a guy in his 50s etc.

These affected folks know very well their circumstance has been caused by their work having been sent offshore. Now how will you justify H1Bs in this situation we are currently in, with 8,000 tech jobs having been slashed in 2009, including 4,100 just last month? This is a 1-2 punch to the American worker. I guarantee you that the Indian born worker will feel the same way once he/she moves off their H1B status - I have seen that first hand among friends. We need to take a honest look in the mirror to answer these questions. I see people parroting free market principles they heard somewhere and articulating it as best as they can. But the bottom line is basically common sense stuff - the employers need to demonstrate they have not been able to hire local talent before applying for H1Bs.

All Americans that have had to train their Indian replacements or been displaced by an Indian L-1 or H-1B employee of an outsourcing firm (TATA, Infosys, WiPro, Patni, etc.) needs to file a discrimination Charge Form with the Office of Special Counsel of the DOJ. It's easy, and they have to investigate. I talk to them frequently about my case. Totally anonymous.

http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/osc/pdf/engfrm.pdf

Thanks for posting this useful info, Steve ;-)

Mere lip service from his end, he knows that all companies do not pay even the prevailing minimum wages in cities like Boston,New York and DC. They work long hours and he himself is a slave driver and talks about reforms. Change and Chaity begins at home, So Mr Bhasin, can you ask your employees first as to if they are happy at your firm with all the manicured lawns and glass facade buildings??
Mere lip service can get you publicity and it ends there, NASSCOM is noting but a platform for sweatshop owners to discuss about their problems.

Steve, just between you and I, there are several lone wolves out there that have had their careers derailed by Indian outsourcing, and are now actively engaged in going after Nasscom people like your friend Pramod Bhasin. TiE (www.tie.org) is also being targeted. There is a tea-party being planned at a public TiE event, and it may not be pretty.

And we all now about Vivek's nightmare.

You might want to let your slave-trader buddies know that some techies are angrier than others.

Yes, they will join China and the Immigration Law Web in fighting visa abuse.

http://discuss.ilw.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/902603441/m/355109222

I agree. Protectionist measures in the current corporate visa programs are misguided - no corporation should be protected from the consequences of discriminatory hiring practices.

Far from protecting the US workforce, the Durbin bill will give us a chance to compete for job openings in our own country.

It's the responsibilty of the federal government to ensure that we have the freedom to compete. It's not protection; it's competetion we need - and we will get this freedom to compete when S.887 passes.

Steve,
I understand that you specialize in the IT industry and offers news and views in this industry alone.

Can you write an article or collaborate with others on outsorucing of non IT related jobs that have been outsourced till date? For Example Outsourcing of the toy industry, PC hardware, clothing industry, Pharmaceutical industry and several other industries that anyone can imagine.

Let's take a trip down memory lane. When was America at its technologial leadership height? When was America at its most prosperous for the middle class? When was American innovation, productivity, and technology second to none? Before the tidal wave of H-1Bs, or after? Come on, it's been about a decade now of large yearly influxes. Cast your vote.

I find it ironic that you are proposing a corrupted organization be involved in reducing the corruption apparent in the H1 and L1 visa scam.

Steve,
I understand that you specialize in the IT industry and offers news and views in this industry alone.
Can you write an article or collaborate with others on outsorucing of non IT related jobs that have been outsourced till date? For Example Outsourcing of the toy industry, PC hardware, clothing industry, Pharmaceutical industry and several other industries that anyone can imagine.
I am asking for such a report because the American people should realize that millions of jobs in manufacturing (toys, PC hardware, Steel, clothing) have been outsourced which is much higher than compared to outsourced IT jobs.

So, what I am saying is stop blaming the IT H-1B visa people.

Don’t bear grudge against H-1B people but bear grudge against the CEO’s who outsourced to save money.

Steve,
I understand that you specialize in the IT industry and offers news and views in this industry alone.
Can you write an article or collaborate with others on outsorucing of non IT related jobs that have been outsourced till date? For Example Outsourcing of the toy industry, PC hardware, clothing industry, Pharmaceutical industry and several other industries that anyone can imagine.
I am asking for such a report because the American people should realize that millions of jobs in manufacturing (toys, PC hardware, Steel, clothing) have been outsourced which is much higher than compared to outsourced IT jobs.

So, what I am saying is stop blaming the IT H-1B visa people.

Don’t bear grudge against H-1B people but bear grudge against the CEO’s who outsourced to save money.

Terminate the program. terminate the fraud. We have over 5 million people out of work in this country, so those nice guest workers that have be taken advantage of can go home with a "Job Well Done" stamp on their passports.

Steve - Tell your editor to get off his ass and give you real reporting projects, like the destruction of the middle-class by Capitalist greed and the depletion of economic stability by failure to provide focused education for United States citizens. Or maybe a story about the outsourcing of United States properity.

Go ahead give it s shot, before they send your job overseas.

Steve, how can your anti-American bigot Vivek Wadhwa still be allowed to teach our children at Duke and write for your magazine. After all, this is what he says when he is trying to mobilize the million+ [mostly] Indian H-1Bs demanding green cards:

"The difference betweenyou and them is that you are smart professionals"

http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showthread.php?p=342502

So Americans who oppose the H-1B program are not "smart professionals"?

This is a rhetorical race war, nothing else, all started by the likes of Nasscom and Wadhwa. And the Americans who the "Indians" think are not "smart professionals" have a few things to teach to the upper-caste creeps who have been denigrating us for years.

An examination of h1bwage.com show that "Genpact Process Solutions LLC" has only applied for 60 H-1B LCAs from 2002 to 2008.

Average Salary of H1b applicants
Company: Genpact Process Solutions LLC
Average Wage: $80,967.03 USDAddress:
40 Old Ridgebury Road
Danbury, CT 06810

Pramod Bhasin, may be someone that we should pay attention to. If he's interested in avoiding a trade war, he'd better start talking fast. Wadhwa is just making things worse.

Perhaps he'd care to comment on immigration blackouts for oversubscribed occupations.

http://immigration-weaver.blogspot.com/2009/03/petition-to-remove-computer-related.html

An ongoing federal probe into H-1B visa fraud leads to many arrests and the indictment of IT services firm Vision Systems Group The controversy over the H-1B visa program for cheap labor workers is heating up once again. Federal agents detained many Indians in six states as part of a wide investigation into suspected visa fraud, those arrested are accused of fraudulently representing themselves or other workers in immigration documents. Besides the arrests, Vision Systems Group, an IT services firm based in South Plainfield, N.J., with a branch office in Coon Rapids, Iowa, was indicted on 10 federal counts, including conspiracy and mail fraud charges. The firm allegedly used fraudulent documents to bring H-1B visa workers into the U.S. The government is seeking the forfeiture of $7.4 million from Vision Systems that was gained through the alleged offenses. Five other technology companies, including Worldwide Software Services and Sana Systems in Clinton, Iowa, remain under investigation for document fraud, prosecutors said. "We are only at the tip of iceberg as to where this investigation leads.

Why do we give so much prominence to shills like Wadhwa when so many of the so-called "antis" have much better industry and experience concerning American workforce conditions? And why are we being called names like 'racist' and 'xenophobe' when the Asian workers and their shills have been insulting us for a decade now, claiming we have no intelligence, work ethic, or skill sets and that we deserve to lose our jobs. I guess it's ok to defame Americans. Follow Wadhwa's comments over on Immigration Voice and see what he really thinks of Americans and who he really supports.

I wonder how many of these crying about h1b and indian workers, buy products from wal-mart? Take a look at the lable, does it not say made in China? Is it ok then for a factory worker in the US to lose his job to a worker in mexico or china and you happily gloat over a cheaper product but when it comes to your job, then it's a problem? Why are GM and chrysler in such troble? Labor wages! That's ok they should fall because I can get a cheaper product made in japan. cry discrimination when it comes to my job? Hypocracy 101

vijay post is pure 'racist' and 'xenophobe', and is a FLAME Post,
Yet it's not deleted. SHAMEFULL!

What's your response 'Steve Hamm'?

"Americans are whiners who can't compete with my Indian brothers and sisters. We worked our ass to get to the top."

Either Bhasin or Vivek Wadhwa is lying. If most H-1Bs go back to India, as Bhasin says, why does Prof. Vivek Wadhwa post on ImmigrationVoice that there are a million+ Indians who came here with H-1Bs and are now in limbo waiting for the green cards.

The truth is that the H-1B was used as a back door to import hundreds of thousands (65k+/yr * 10+yrs) of low-wage (and in I.T, pretty low-skill) Indian visa workers. Many were exploited by their Indian bodyshoppers. There was NEVER a word about that from NASSCOM or Whadha.

But all of the sudden, they acknowledge the corruption and abuse of their fellow Indians, and act like they care.

And this sordid outsourcing program has impacted 3-4 million American hi-tech professionals. Some have been forced totally out of the industry. Many have have seen their wages decline. Some have been forced to train their Indian replacement.

It is sad chapter in the history of United States business -- and one day the journalists, corporate execs, politicians, professors, and lobbyists that helped facilitate this legal discrimination of Americans will hold their head in shame.

Once the American middle class is destroyed the American economy will be in a dread decline (much worse than now), American programmers will start work for the wages comparable with the Indian ones. The jobs will return. It will be a rather painful process with "crash of American dream" and so on.

@ H1B=Discrimination

Went to see an apartment in NJ and at the countertop in the kitchen there was a paystub from the prior tenant (indian guy)and I was shocked when I saw his gross salary $45K no other benefit. Now I know why they have several people living in same apartment. So you are being to generous with your $65K

There is a company called pixlinc.com that has a Perl/SQL/Java coders position that is looking for "Indian H1" resources. How discriminating can you get when Indians based in NY/NJ want "Indian H1" people? That is very discriminating and probably because the company doesn't understand the illegality of their posting!

Great Post ! Rock On !

Rapid Visa
http://www.rapid-visas.co.uk

I'm an US born 14 year tech consultant and I can say after working for different corporations, it takes about 2-3 india h1 workers to compete with my skills, so if these companies think they are getting a bargain it's all a smokescreen, because most of these guys are not creative, they are just robots, reading a book and follow someone else's lead, real technologists will tell you the same thing, there are better ways to improve on technology, and the tech market its all about being on top.