First of all, Rita, Babson is best known for its strength in entrepreneurship. Do you feel that is the premier reason why people apply to the program?

I think there are three reasons. Entrepreneurship has been a great entree into a discussion for probably about 70% to 80% of our applications. I also see in the U.S. and abroad a real interest in the international perspective shown through international programs that we offer. It's interesting that I see both being talked about. Obviously the reputation and ratings are being made through the entrepreneurship area, but applicants will find out about our international programs.

Another reason I think Babson is grabbing attention is for what we call our "field-based" programs, which allow our students to work hand-in-hand with companies. There are a substantial number of companies located in the Boston area and overseas where we've established our field-based programs. There's a mentor project that is integrated into the first year of the MBA program in which teams of five to seven students work with mentor companies throughout the Boston area. The class of 145 is divided into roughly 25 teams. Then, in the summer, they're working in internships in the U.S. or abroad. About 60 to 65 students work outside the U.S. for a three-month internship. During their second year there are opportunities to gain field experience in other areas such as management consulting. So, after they have digested that first year of fundamentals, they're working on a consulting basis for Boston area businesses. And those consulting projects have functional focuses in marketing, finance, or MIS, which students do receive credit for.

And have applicants taken notice of Babson curricular innovations? I guess one way to find that out is by the number of applications the school received this past year (for the class of '99)...

Our official application total topped out at 900. That's up 7% from the year before.

I know that the number of students in Babson's part-time program is far larger than the number in the full-time program. Do you think this is a function of people owning their own businesses -- another facet of the school's niche in entrepreneurship?

No. I think what we are promoting in our literature and verbally is that entrepreneurship can be applied to any size business. Certainly our candidates come to us hoping to start their own businesses, but they're also coming with the understanding that what they're getting out of the Olin program is an approach to business be it small, medium, or large. A certain number of our students, particularly our international students, are coming from a family business -- I'm seeing that more and more in the U.S. population as well...

Part-timers are certainly working for companies right now which could be any size. They are improving their entrepreneurial skills to improve their current position in their current company, move to another company, or start their own business.

What do you feel is pushing the Babson program forward?

I think we're seen in the Boston area as a quality program. We're actually rated ninth in the U.S. in terms of part time programs (according to a tally conducted by U.S. News & World Report on America's best graduate schools). Our evening program is the more traditional of the programs. It still has for its required courses individual core courses and one thing that the evening program task force is working on is integrating more of those core courses to mimic the first year of the two-year program, which has totally integrated core requirements. So the evening program has incrementally become much more innovative. I think also that the evening program students are certainly taking advantage of all of the entrepreneurship courses available.

How many entrepreneurship courses does Babson offer?

It keeps changing. We're in the midst of putting together our new catalogue, and have nine from last year's catalogue. I think there are 11 or 12 right now.

Babson also offers a one-year program for candidates who boast an undergrad degree in business. When was this started?

That's right. It started in 1991.

Has it expanded since its inception?

No, we actually accept the same number of people as we did from the beginning. We admit 98 per year and enroll about 40 from there. Two years ago we enrolled 45, last year it was 35 for a 38% yield. And this current year, when it started in May, we admitted 98 and 54 enrolled for a 55% yield.

So it seems like enrollment in the one-year program fluctuates, but that it is a popular item for candidates with prior business experience.

It would seem that way. We do emphasize the accelerated part of it. There's quite a turnaround. The one-year program is not designed for career changers. It's really for people who are very targeted and know what they want to do next.

Rita, can you break down the class sizes for Babson's full-time, one-year, and part-time programs?

145 entered the two-year program, for a 37% yield. The part-time program has a fall and spring entry, and the fall entry is our big one. This fall we enrolled 245 for a 68% yield on admits. In the spring, we enrolled 128 for a yield of 65%. Broken down further, for the fall (part-time program) we had 430 applications, we accepted 357, and then enrolled 245. In the spring we had 240 apps, accepted 196, and enrolled 128.

We consider the evening (part-time) program differently from the full-time, two-year program. The evening program has less of a limit on the number of seats available. Thus, we admit all of those who qualify given our criteria.

How about for the full-time program?

That's pretty restricted. We're trying each year to be more selective. Out of 900 applications, we accepted 395 to enroll 145.

Has enrollment changed for the better or worse since last year (1996)?

Well, last year, for the two-year program, we received 845 applications, and the year before that (1995) we received 779 applications. So it has been a similar rate of increase in applications over the past three years: Around 9% two years ago, 8% in 1996, and 10% this year. This year we admitted 395; two years ago it was 411; and in 1996 it was 404. The enrollment in 1995 was 143; it was 147 in 1996; and again, it was 145 in 1997. So we're enrolling within a very tight range.

I think the only year we were down in terms of application increase was 1994. Everything else has been a real improvement over the past five years.

In which demographic population area are you seeing the sharpest growth -- women, internationals, minorities, older applicants?

Internationals. We've done a report on international applications comparing last year to this year, and overall applications have gone up. We had 467 foreign applications this year and 381 last year, up 23%. They now comprise more than 50% of our applicant pool. Last year they were 45%, this year they're 52%.

Is there any particular hot spot of the world where an overwhelming number of Babson's foreign applications are coming from?

This year it has been Asia. Asian applications are up about 21% over last year.

In what ways is Babson catering to the international applicant, as far as recruitment is concerned?

There are a couple of things going on. Babson offers quite a bit of international programming, and for a small school we have a large international student body make-up of 30%. International students are also very interested in the entrepreneurship area. They're also driven by ratings.What we've found is that students have to use published sources in a lot of cases as guidance for what school to go to. Since Babson has been rated in entrepreneurship, they know about it, and that certainly helps.

What are this year's application deadlines?

There are three deadlines: January 15, March 1, and April 15.

And the turnaround for response?

It takes six to eight weeks for a response -- that's what we publish, although we do it in batches so that as applications become ready and complete, we can make our decision promptly. But we guarantee that it won't be longer than six to eight weeks.

Is there a separate deadline for applying for a fellowship or scholarship?

No, there's no separate application deadline. And, scholarships are available for anyone because they're all merit-based.

Including international students?

Yes.

Do you have an idea of how many seats or spots generally get filled per deadline?

No, not in number. What I can say is that each year, as the application pool has become stronger -- and it has become significantly stronger -- we've probably filled most of the seats by the first and second deadlines, and really only consider those who are quite strong during the third deadline. Given that Babson is looking for a diverse population while improving its quality, applicants to the third deadline might find themselves in a bind in that we are also interested in lowering our admit rate. So if we feel we can fill the class in the first two cycles, we will.

I don't think there's a strong advantage to being in the first cycle over the second, but I do know what will happen this year -- we're going to be more stringent about who we accept into the program. Last year was very interesting for me to see because applications were so much stronger than the year before. We were being much more careful about every decision that we made. Even very strong candidates were being held over to the second or third cycle.

Can you list for me the different elements involved in the Babson application?

Essays -- we have four required and one optional; a resume; two letters of recommendation; transcripts; a $50 application fee that can be waived for minority students, top candidates, and for some international applicants who really find it difficult to find a $50 check; the GMAT, of course; and the interview, which is required.

Do you tend to look at any one or two of those variables more so than the others?

I'd say we balance the GMAT, the essays, and the interview. Those are the three big ones. We also require the work experience, which isn't on that list. There is a two-year work experience requirement, and there is no one enrolled in the Babson MBA program who has less than two years of work experience. That means that we weigh work experience more heavily than the GPA; it really tells us a lot about a person's potential, past accomplishments, and ability to be successful. The average amount of work experience for the class of '99 is 6 years.

I understand that Babson places a lot of importance on a campus visit.

That's correct. Babson is a small school and a small program and currently we're a niche player. We have the reputation in entrepreneurship and I think a growing reputation in international programs. Our classes are small and the faculty is really dedicated to getting to know every student. Our classes are unique, and we feel that the integrated format of the first year is actually something that has to be seen to understand how it works. We feel that it's important for candidates to see the program, talk to students and faculty, and sit in on classes to understand how the integration works. There are no functional silo courses here. Instead we think of all of our course work as streams that pick up several functional areas at the same time -- cases are analyzed and faculty team teach. All of the courses are taught in modules. So the visit is integral.

There are general information sessions and a morning visitors program that explain what the Babson program offers. What do they entail and when do they occur?

Yes, we have general information sessions that shed light on all the programs that Babson offers. They happen on the first Wednesday of each month.

The morning visitor's program happens Tuesday mornings. We've chosen that day because that happens to be the day of the MBA Coffee -- an event where faculty, administrators, and students have a chance to chat over coffee. The MBA Coffee happens from 9:30 - 10:30am, and it provides an opportunity for visitors to meet students and faculty after a tour of the Olin building. Afterwards visitors attend module classes. We offer interviews after prospective applicants have had a chance to sit in on a class.

We encourage applicants to visit our campus any day of the week, but we feel that Tuesday is the best time for applicants to learn about us.

Is Babson now using the Web as a way for applicants to fill-out and return applications?

Yes we do. We're going through CollegeEdge. We just started this year, and have already received a couple of applications. It's probably been in effect for the last month.

I know that, in recent years, Babson has really been tightening the screws on its admission standards -- the school is being much more selective in terms of who it chooses to admit. As a result, the students' average GMAT score has been rising incrementally -- it was 598 for the Class of '98, up 93 points from a decade ago. Is the GMAT average continuing to climb?

Yes, undoubtedly. The GMAT average has been rising for quite awhile. In 1993 it was 580; in 1994, it was 583; in 1996, it was 598; and 1997, we jumped to 622. Our goal is certainly to stay right around that. We're increasing the class to about 150 for the fall of 1998. And we're very mindful of maintaining the quality of our student body. The GMAT and the level of the applicant's work experience are very important to us.

Do you evaluate the GMAT holistically, or in parts (AWA [Analytical Writing Assessment], Quant, Verbal)?

We look at the GMAT holistically except if there is a weakness in one area -- in the quant end, for example. As a general rule, we tailor our evaluation of the GMAT to the background of the applicant. We want as diverse a class as possible. This year, about one-third of the class are liberal arts and humanities majors; another third have business and economics backgrounds, and the last third of the class come from engineering, math, or computer backgrounds.

Do you weigh the second or third GMAT score as heavily as the first if the applicant has taken the test more than once?

We take the highest score.

How heavily in your mind does an applicant's undegrad institution weigh?

I think it's important to see what school they come from because we want to be able to balance an applicant with a lower GPA from a top school with an applicant with a higher GPA from a less rigorous school. We aren't just looking for the Harvard and Stanford types, we're looking for individuals who can contribute something to each class.

You mentioned that interviews are required. Are most of them conducted when applicants visit?

I think inteviews have been required for the last four years. We interview candidates here on campus, and also while we're traveling. We interview at every country and forum site that we visit. We also conduct them by telephone.

How does the interview fit into your overall evaluation of applicants?

I think it's one of the top three criteria that we use because it's through the interview that we are discovering the fit of each candidate for our class. We're asking questions that will allow candidates to let us know about their backgrounds, their work experience, their problem-solving abilites, and whether they have strong communication skills. We want to know about their approach toward team work.

For international students we use it as another test of their ability to communicate orally. The first year is so intense in terms of fitting all of the required courses into the module structure that students have to come with fairly strong English skills (Editor's Note: Babson's TOEFL average is around 630; the minimum is about 600).

What should applicants do to prepare themselves for the interview?

They should know the program well enough to ask intelligent questions. We're asking applicants questions that will show us their ability to think on their feet -- we hope that they don't know the questions ahead of time. In general, applicants should be able to discuss their work experience as well as the value that they would add to the class if they were accepted.

Who conducts the interviews at Babson?

The admissions staff and second-year students. We have student fellows who have received fellowships to work on campus about eight hours per week for their first year, and 12 hours per week for their second year. They do project work and also interview in our office. One of the things that we think is important is the current students' knowledge of fit in the program -- how students will contribute to a class during a case discussion, for example. We think that they're very capable of assessing a candidate's fit during the interview.

How many fellows are there?

We have six in the this office.

Many applicants tend to be a little superstitious when they realize that they're going to be interviewed by a student, that the interview may not hold as much weight as it would if it were conducted by an admissions officer. Is that true?

We train our students really well and feel that they give us real insights into a candidate. We think that they understand the requirements and rigors of the program, and the fit that we're looking for. I know it's an issue. When candidates say that they only want to interview with a staff member, we'll try to accommodate them. If the interview has already taken place though, we won't do it a second time. But we'd be happy to talk with them and discuss any issues they may have. In general, it is to the candidate's advantage to talk to as many people as possible.

You mentioned earlier that there are four required essays and one optional. Have the essay questions changed over the past couple of years? Have there been any new developments?

They haven't changed substantially over the past couple of years. I did insert one additional question two years ago asking candidates to explain the type of international experience they've garnered. We're interested in whether they have worked in a foreign country or traveled abroad, and whether they are multilingual.

Do you set word limits on the essays?

We don't impose word limits.

I would surmise then that you've read some long-winded essays.

I read every word. The candidate should be succinct but complete. The essays are a great opportunity for applicants to let us know who they are.

Who do you want to write the applicants' two recommendations?

We'd like them to come from employers, coworkers, clients, or previous employers. In other words, a work environment recommender, as opposed to a personal or academic recommender.

I know that Babson recently instituted a two-year minimum amount of work experience...

That's right. Someone could have a fairly low GPA which could be overcome by substantial work experience. The number of years an applicant has been on the job and the level of their responsibility is what we want to hear about. The GPA cannot be changed, it's history. But from there, people can do quite amazing and interesting things -- that's what we want to know about.

What can an applicant with little to no work experience do to bolster his or her chances of acceptance?

They simply can't get in. In that situation, we will either deny or defer them. If someone has less than two years of professional work experience, but is close to two years, we'll probably defer that candidate.

So you allow applicants to defer? About how many?

Yes, we defer for one year, but we don't encourage it. We would prefer that admitted candidates attend the year that they are applying.

What is Babson's waitlist policy?

Last year we created a very small waitlist -- about 10 candidates who showed a strong commitment to Babson. In the end, we took four off of that waitlist.

What can applicants on the waitlist do to up their chances of acceptance?

Often applicants are placed on the waitlist because their GMAT is only marginally lower than what we're looking for. The new computerized-adapted GMAT (CAT) will create a whole new world for this spring's waitlist because candidates will be able to improve at least one aspect of their application, their GMAT, from month-to-month. It certainly gives candidates a chance to improve their profiles within a fairly short amount of time.

Do you encourage rejected applicants to re-apply or provide them with some form of counseling?

Yes. Our rejection letter is generally a form letter which includes our current criteria and class averages so candidates can look at their own profile and guage where they stand against the admitted pool. Also, every staff member here will handwrite a letter of encouragement to the rejected candidates explaining to them what part of their file needs improvement. For example, the letter may say: "You have great work experience, but you might consider retaking the GMAT" ... or vice-versa. Our applicant pool is pretty small, so we try to personalize our rejection letters.

What's this year's tuition?

For the full-time program it's $21,630 -- that's with tuition and fees. For the one-year program, because they're paying for a full year's worth of tuition, it's $30,315. The part-time is $1,959 per course.

What would you estimate the annual cost of living to be in the Wellesley area?

Right now we say that living expenses are just under $12,000 for nine months. We estimate the one-year living expense to be $15,617.

You mentioned that Babson offers several fellowships...

Yes, we offer fellowships which are full-tuition and award about 15 of those per year. They are renewed for the second year based on academic performance. We also have a new category called the Olin scholarship. We've received substantial funding from the Olin Foundation -- it helped fund the new Olin building and it also funds scholarship. Last year the Olin scholarship was $15,000. This year we're thinking about decreasing the award to $10,000 per scholarship so that we can offer more of them to help spread the money around. We're currently reviewing our scholarship to see whether we can offer more support to our students. There were 23 Olin scholars last year.

Can you offer any advice to students looking for a scholarship?

Babson scholarships are based on merit, so the best thing for a student to do is perform well on the GMAT, have a competitive GPA, and a solid amount of work experience.

Who are your toughest competitors?

Locally, our biggest competitor is Boston University; I believe we probably lost nine applicants to BU. We also compete with Harvard in a smaller way ... we maybe lost two or three candidates to HBS. In general, the big local competitors are Boston College, Boston University, and Harvard. Our not so local competitors are NYU and Wharton. For international programs we compete with Thunderbird, USC, and South Carolina. Duke is another strong competitor.

Rita, would you like to add anything else before we wrap up?

What I'd like to end with is the area that doesn't get talked about a lot and doesn't get rated, and that's the integrated curriculum. Having spoken with collegues at other programs, I think that Babson is way ahead in terms of the intergration of the core curriculum. I think Indiana's integrated curriculum has been working, and the Ivey School of Business, in Canada, also has a well-integrated curriculum.

At Babson, during the first semester, the students do a competitive benchmarking of their mentor company's industry and of a competitor to that mentor company. In the second semester the same team works on a consulting project for the same company, building on what they've learned during the first semester. So I think Babson has a lot to say on curriculum reform. Our integrated curriculum fits nicely with the general management focus.

Rita, thanks for discussing the Babson program with me today.